<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii">
<meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)">
<!--[if !mso]><style>v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</style><![endif]--><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:Helvetica;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Wingdings;
panose-1:5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Yu Gothic";
panose-1:2 11 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Verdana;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Aptos;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@Yu Gothic";
panose-1:2 11 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:#467886;
text-decoration:underline;}
span.EmailStyle20
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif;
color:windowtext;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-size:10.0pt;
mso-ligatures:none;}
@page WordSection1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
/* List Definitions */
@list l0
{mso-list-id:444811225;
mso-list-template-ids:1065388956;}
@list l0:level1
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level2
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:o;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New";
mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
@list l0:level3
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level4
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level5
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level6
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level7
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level8
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level9
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l1
{mso-list-id:1123502470;
mso-list-template-ids:-534722254;}
@list l1:level1
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l1:level2
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l1:level3
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l1:level4
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l1:level5
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l1:level6
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l1:level7
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l1:level8
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l1:level9
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l2
{mso-list-id:1148088636;
mso-list-template-ids:-899411226;}
@list l2:level1
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l2:level2
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:o;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New";
mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
@list l2:level3
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0A7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l2:level4
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0A7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l2:level5
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0A7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l2:level6
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0A7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l2:level7
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0A7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l2:level8
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0A7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l2:level9
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0A7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l3
{mso-list-id:1455368507;
mso-list-template-ids:-909901296;}
@list l3:level1
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level2
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level3
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level4
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level5
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level6
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level7
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level8
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level9
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
ol
{margin-bottom:0in;}
ul
{margin-bottom:0in;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->
</head>
<body lang="EN-US" link="#467886" vlink="#96607D" style="word-wrap:break-word">
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">I could do slightly earlier than this. Have to drop my car off that morning for an oil change and they close at 5. Could we do 3:30 to 4:30 or 3 to 4?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Doug Hayman<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">IT Accessibility Coordinator<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Information Technology<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Olympic College<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><a href="mailto:dhayman@olympic.edu"><span style="color:#467886">dhayman@olympic.edu</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">(360) 475-7632 <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> athen-list <athen-list-bounces@mailman22.u.washington.edu>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Sara Larkin via athen-list<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, June 4, 2025 1:46 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Michael Cantino <mcantino@nwresd.k12.or.us>; Access Technology Higher Education Network <athen-list@u.washington.edu>; athen-list-request@mailman22.u.washington.edu<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] - Re: [Athen] Is SimBraille in Word documents compatible with refreshable braille displays?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div style="border:solid #030303 1.0pt;padding:1.0pt 1.0pt 1.0pt 1.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-line-height-alt:10.0pt;background:#FFCC66"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">CAUTION: This email came from a non-OC system or external source. Beware of phishing and social engineering!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Definitely try it and check with the student. The only way that I can think of that it might work is if it has already been translated to braille using some form of translation software, copied into the document,
and converted to SimBraille or some other braille font and the student is using computer braille. Then it is just showing the braille cell that corresponds to the character. Computer braille is the only setting that will keep the corresponding characters without
translation, but it would still require the translation software before copying it into the document, otherwise, like others have said, the translation used by the screen reader would change it for everything except computer braille. If you did that though,
it may work for the braille display, but the screen reader would not voice it correctly. That is just my suspicion anyway. Our students have never asked for SimBraille or any form of braille in a Word document, since they would generally use the screenreader
and let its capabilities and setting do the work for translation.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Sara <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="800" style="width:600.0pt">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td width="100" style="width:75.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"><img border="0" width="105" height="113" style="width:1.0937in;height:1.177in" id="Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:image001.jpg@01DBD557.C267DFA0" alt="IESBVI Logo"></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</td>
<td width="550" style="width:412.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 0in">
<div style="border:none;border-left:solid #CACACA 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 23.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:14.05pt">
<b><span style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#EE3C4A;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual">Sara Larkin</span></b><span style="font-size:8.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#222D63;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual"><br>
<i>Statewide Math Consultant</i><br>
(319) 310-6070<br>
</span><span style="font-size:8.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#818184;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual">3501 Harry Langdon Boulevard, Council Bluffs, IA 51503</span><span style="font-size:8.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#222D63;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual"><br>
</span><a href="https://www.iesbvi.org/"><span style="font-size:8.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:blue;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual">https://www.iesbvi.org/</span></a><span style="font-size:8.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#222D63;mso-ligatures:standardcontextual"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> athen-list <<a href="mailto:athen-list-bounces@mailman22.u.washington.edu">athen-list-bounces@mailman22.u.washington.edu</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Michael Cantino via athen-list<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, June 4, 2025 3:29 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:athen-list@u.washington.edu">athen-list@u.washington.edu</a>;
<a href="mailto:athen-list-request@mailman22.u.washington.edu">athen-list-request@mailman22.u.washington.edu</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Athen] Is SimBraille in Word documents compatible with refreshable braille displays?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">I agree with Deborah. Give the student a file, and let them determine how well it will work. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">That said, I don't see how it could work outside of a BRF file. I tested it with my braille display, and it did not provide me with the correct braille transcription. Here's a quick explanation
of where this is breaking down.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<ul type="disc">
<li class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo3">
<span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">I typed the text "This is plain text with simbraille." into a Word document. If I change this font to simbraille, you won't be able to tell the difference on the braille display because only the font is changing.
Visually, the braille will start to look incorrect (like dots 4-6 for a period instead of dots 2-5-6)<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo3">
<span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">This really starts to break down once you prepare the simbraille as a correct braille transcription. Using the same sample text as before, the sentence would look like this: ",? is pla9 text ) simbrl4"<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<ul type="disc">
<ul type="circle">
<li class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l2 level2 lfo3">
<span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">The screen reader is going to translate this text into either contracted or uncontracted braille because it still thinks it's looking at print. It doesn't know that it's already being provided with a braille translation. <o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l2 level2 lfo3">
<span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">The capital indicator will be translated as a comma. The th- contraction (represented by the question mark) will be translated as a question mark. The -in contraction (represented by a 9) will be translated as
a 9, and so on. <o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
</ul>
<ul type="disc">
<li class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo3">
<span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">Even if you write out the text as if it's uncontracted simbraille and you set your screen reader settings to translate into uncontracted braille, you're still going to have issues. Capitalization indicators, punctuation,
and other symbols will not be interpreted correctly. Something like a number indicator, which is the # symbol in simbraille, will be translated as the 2-cell braille equivalent (_#) in uncontracted or contracted braille.</span><o:p></o:p></li></ul>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">Basically, you can't trick the display into not translating the print text. The best you could do is give it nice, clean print text to translate, but you'll still run into issues with symbols
that are unique to braille, like the transcriber note indicator. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">Good luck! If someone else cracks this, I would be very interested to know. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">Michael Cantino (he/him)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">BVIS Technology Specialist</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">Northwest Regional Education Service District</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">(503)614-1339</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal">NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments is covered by the Electronic Communication Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. 2510-2521, is confidential, and intended solely for addressee. In addition, any student related
information contained in this e-mail (including attachments) is protected by the Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act of 1994. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of
this communication is strictly prohibited. Please immediately notify the sender by reply e-mail or phone and delete this message and its attachments, if any. This communication and any response to it may constitute a public record and, therefore, may be available
upon request in accordance with Iowa public records law, Iowa Code Chapter 22. [8th2]
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</body>
</html>